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Umfriend

HDD Stand-by settings - How to?

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Hope this is appropriate and someone can help me.

 

I have 2 Pools consisting of 2x2TB HDDs, x2 duplication. One Pool is solely used for client backups, the other for most of the shares. Also, a Server Backup HDD and a seperate data HDD. Scanner is running as well.

 

I would like these HDDs to spin down when not used for more then one minute (and is there a downside to this, i.e., is spinning up something that contributes to wear & tear of the HDD?). I have set this in the Power Options of Windows.

 

Given that there is a myriad of settings in scanner that affects this, I am at a loss how to accomplish this and especially as I would preferably like to have Scanner read the SMART details (amongst which the temps I think). So how do you guys get this to work?

The types of HDDs I have are:

Seagate 2TB NAS (ST2000VN000)

Seagate 2TB Desktop (ST2000DM001)

Seagate 8TB Archive

WD 4TB NAS (WD40EFRX)

HGST 700GB (HTS541075A9E680, 2.5")

 

What I have done now, for all HDDs in Scanner is:

- Disk Settings: All options are OFF (incl. Query power mode directly from disk)

- Disk Control: Disabled Advanced Power Management and Standby Timer (although the latter will not remain blacnk and show a fat dash when I open Disk Control again...)

- Scanner Settings -> SMART: Throttle queries not more than 5 minutes

 

As far as I can tell, all HDDs go to stand-by but are woken again after 5 minutes (I guess due to reading SMART).

 

Can this be improved upon?

 

Kind rgds,

Umf

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Reading the SMART data can (and usually does) wake up the systems.  The default of "60 minutes" for this setting is usually pretty good for power savings. 

For the most part, this may be the setting that has the most affect on the system. Try changing it to something much higher, and see if that helps.

 

 

And yes, the load and unload of the read heads during the spindown and spinup cycles can contribute to the wear of the drive. This is specifically the "Load Cycle Count" SMART values, actually. So when you hear about high LCC, it's aggressively idling the drives. 

 

 

 

As for the Disk Control settings, these are finicky, and depend on the firmware's support. They don't always work "as expected". 

 

 

 

I know it's a nice, long thread, but have you checked out this tread yet:

http://community.covecube.com/index.php?/topic/48-questions-regarding-hard-drive-spindownstandby/

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Thanks. And yes, I did read that thread but have re-read it and understand it a bit better. One of things that I wonder is about "The implementation of Advanced Power Management is completely up to the manufacturer of the drive, and there are no specifications that explicitly state what each power mode does. This entire feature may not even be supported, depending on the disk model." - I was sortof hoping that users of Scanner could combine their experience for various HDD models. For instance, I can set Advanced Power Management for all but can configure this for none.

 

Another thing is about throttling reading SMART. I like the option to not read SMART when the HDD is powered down but what if you combine this with throttling every 60 minutes. A HDD may be stand-by after 60 minutes, wake up after 70 and suspend again after 80. Will SMART ever be read for this HDD (or does it potentially postpone until it scans the HDD which lasts longer than 60 minutes for sure)?

 

Is the temp displayed in Scanner the result of a SMART read (i.e. does it spin-up the drive to get the temp)?

 

Somewhat related, it appears as if there are some services that can spin up an HDD (Windows Search for indexing?). Can one disable Windows Search without interferring with Server Backups?

 

And then there is "storageservice.exe" that occaisionally accesses loads of files for whatever reason (shadow copies are disabled on all HDDs).

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Thanks. And yes, I did read that thread but have re-read it and understand it a bit better. One of things that I wonder is about "The implementation of Advanced Power Management is completely up to the manufacturer of the drive, and there are no specifications that explicitly state what each power mode does. This entire feature may not even be supported, depending on the disk model." - I was sortof hoping that users of Scanner could combine their experience for various HDD models. For instance, I can set Advanced Power Management for all but can configure this for none.

Frankly, I just leave my disks running 24/7. They're all NAS quality drives, so they're rated for it.  I let Windows manage the activity. Mainly, because I find it much simpler than trying to manage the power settings, and stressing over that. (i've not seen a good solution for that, with any software, honestly).

 

 

Another thing is about throttling reading SMART. I like the option to not read SMART when the HDD is powered down but what if you combine this with throttling every 60 minutes. A HDD may be stand-by after 60 minutes, wake up after 70 and suspend again after 80. Will SMART ever be read for this HDD (or does it potentially postpone until it scans the HDD which lasts longer than 60 minutes for sure)?

The SMART queries will wake up the disk (in most, if not all cases).  So setting it to "60 minutes" would wake up the drives every hour. you should be able to set it to longer, if you want.

Alternatively, you can set StableBit Scanner to only query SMART data during the work window (and set that work window to a limited time). 

 

But yes, it would be read, just not as frequently. Which should allow it to idle/spin down better.

 

Is the temp displayed in Scanner the result of a SMART read (i.e. does it spin-up the drive to get the temp)?

Yes. This is specifically pulled from the SMART data. And yes, it would spin it up.

 

We do poll the SMART data frequently to give you accurate info (especially about the temperature). So, the trade of is "realtime data" vs spin down. 

 

Somewhat related, it appears as if there are some services that can spin up an HDD (Windows Search for indexing?). Can one disable Windows Search without interferring with Server Backups?

 

And then there is "storageservice.exe" that occaisionally accesses loads of files for whatever reason (shadow copies are disabled on all HDDs).

Anything that accesses the disks (directly or via DrivePool) could spin up the disks. 

Windows Search is one of those programs. You can disable it, but the remote access website relies on the data from this to list the contents of the shares. 

 

And "StorageService" is part of Essentials as well. It polls the disks for information (such as their existance, capacity, free space, etc), and this would wake up the disks. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To be honest, if you're looking for power savings, or limiting the wear and tear on the system, the best option may actually be "LightsOut", which can put the entire system to sleep. That would be much more aggressive and thorough. And we do offer some limited interoperability with LightsOut (the "Running" files).

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Actually, it is not about power savings for the electricity bill, it is about heat in the case, I like it really really cool. Can't let the system sleep as it runs @Rosetta (on an underclocked and undervolted CPU).

 


The SMART queries will wake up the disk (in most, if not all cases).  So setting it to "60 minutes" would wake up the drives every hour. you should be able to set it to longer, if you want.

Alternatively, you can set StableBit Scanner to only query SMART data during the work window (and set that work window to a limited time). 

 

But yes, it would be read, just not as frequently. Which should allow it to idle/spin down better.

I was actually wondering about the interaction between setting throttling and checking the option "Do not query if the disk has spun down" in the same screen.

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Ah, okay.

That's actually one of the reasons I really like the rackmount cases. Great airflow, and HDDs get the "fresh" air first (usually).

And I'm assuming you don't have the room to just shove in more fans, and that you don't really want to get a new case.

 

As for the "Do not query if the disk has spun down", I believe that this is only in regards to querying the power state (as Windows considers this activity and will wake up the drive). And this applies only to the manually initiated "Put into standby" option (when right clicking on the disks).

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Ah new case will come someday. Just bought an Icy Dock 5 HDD in 3x5.25" cage. Rather nice but cooling wise, meh. In any case, once DP features Grouping (or "Strings"?) I can build my desired 2 x 4 x 2TB Pool for which I'll need another, larger case. So the fact that I do not have that yet is, basically, all your fault! ;d

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It has a fan which was loud and I replaced it with a silent fan. But there simply are hardly any holes in the electronics board at the back between the fan and the HDDs so it does not cool as much. But with all the standing by and all they measure between 25C and 40C over time. With 25C being rather low, sometime in autumn I'll up the CPU frequency and SMART throttling so they don't freeze ;)

 

Now if only it was easy to find a case that had 6 or 7 5.25" slots that can be modded to accept these HDD bays...

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Hi I used to use Xigmatek Utgard these can take 3 x 5drive enclosure's have excellent airflow I still have the 2 I used excellent case's I moved to rack mount that's the only reason I stopped useing them. Plenty of reviews on line of the case

 

9 x 5.25 slots

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