Raw data and external backups

[Dude]

Hi, I haven't tried your product yet, but I was wondering how the raw files/folders look on the drives if I were to look at them? Are they completely scattered all over the place or are they grouped somewhat? I'm just thinking the worse case senario where all I have is the raw data disks and need to grab the data out of them.

Also, say I want to backup some or all of the files to an external source (will be using WHS2011).  How do you recomend I do this such that the regular windows folder struture is preserved.

More info, not sure if I would use  1.x or 2.x but leaning towards 2.x.

Thanks

 

[Umfriend]

Christopher will explain, I'm sure, I'd mess it up, especially as they are working on grouping/ordering add-ins that I use nor understand. What may be good to know though is that a single file is never scattered over drives and that each disk can be accessed on another computer and you'll find the files in regular NTFS format, no special drivers/software needed. Each drive will have a hidden "poolpart" folder within which you'll find the exact folder structure that Explorer would show you for the entire Pool. But if you are looking to find file "X", you will not know, AFAIK, on which disk(s) it resides.

 

Do you intend to use the reguler WHS2011 Server Backup functionality? If so, then realise that you can not backup a Pool, that is the virtual huge drive consisting of actual drives. You'll have to backup the underlying drives. In one sense, this is great as it is easier to deal with the volume limit of 2TB for WHS2011 Server Backup. It's a bit of a pain though if you use duplication and more than 2 drives as you'd backup each file twice for no reason.

 

This is why I have a 2x2TB 2x duplication Pool. I just need to backup 1 of the two drives. Should I need more space at some stage then I would create another 2x2TB 2x duplication Pool and backup 1 disk of each 2x2TB set. WHS2011 Server Backup _can_ backup more than 2TB of data but not more than 2TB per volume (say, disk) and other than that I think the only limit is the size of the backup drive.

[Dude]

Well I was planning on using the WHS2011 Server Backup functionality at least for the OS. For Pictures, My Documents etc, I plan on using the Libraries feature on each PC to store these items directly on the server.

[Umfriend]

And where/how would you then have a backup of such pictures, documents etc?

[Dude]

So Drivepool has the duplicate feature, so backup made.

 

Still I will have an offsite backup plan as well.

[Umfriend]

DP != backup. Theft, fire, hitting del *.*...

 

WHS server backup, IMO, is a real gem. Just put in a HDD bracket, change once a week and rotate offsite. Now that is serious business.

[Dude]

...

 

Do you intend to use the reguler WHS2011 Server Backup functionality? If so, then realise that you can not backup a Pool, that is the virtual huge drive consisting of actual drives. You'll have to backup the underlying drives. In one sense, this is great as it is easier to deal with the volume limit of 2TB for WHS2011 Server Backup. It's a bit of a pain though if you use duplication and more than 2 drives as you'd backup each file twice for no reason.

 

This is why I have a 2x2TB 2x duplication Pool. I just need to backup 1 of the two drives. Should I need more space at some stage then I would create another 2x2TB 2x duplication Pool and backup 1 disk of each 2x2TB set. WHS2011 Server Backup _can_ backup more than 2TB of data but not more than 2TB per volume (say, disk) and other than that I think the only limit is the size of the backup drive.

 

I can't say I understand this all completely. I have 3 PC's and one HTPC to backup. 2 PCs have < 1TB each. 1 PC has 3TB and the HTPC has round 2.5 TB. The HTPC recorded TV is not critical to backup, but the 3TB pc stuff is (this disks on this PC are broken up into partitions with none > 1TB). What do you recommend I do? I have 2 4TB drives to start and plan on adding a pair more soon. I  havn't buit the WHS2011 server yet, waiting for hardware now.

[Christopher (Drashna)]

Dude,

 

StableBit DrivePool stores the files on normal NTFS volumes, as normal files. The are located in hidden "PoolPart" folders, and we recommend that you don't use these folders directly. Except in special cases (seeding a new pool, or data recovery, for example). 

 

As for how the files are placed? "shotgun scatter".  Specifically, when a new file is added to the pool, StableBit DrivePool places new files on the disk(s) with the most available free space. This can cause the data be very scattered.

 

However, the Ordered File Placement balancer changes this default behavior and fills one disk at a time (or two if duplication is enabled). And it tends to keep the contents of the folders on the same disk.

https://stablebit.com/DrivePool/Plugins

 

 

 

And umfriend is right, duplication != backup. Duplication protects you against a drive failure. However, if you delete the files off the pool.... it's gone. No backup to restore from.

 

 

 

As for the backup, and limitations, that 2TB limit applies to the SERVER Backup feature. However, the client backup shoudl work fine. But you should test it just in case. And if it has issues, then install the UEFI patch for WHS2011.

[Umfriend]

WHS2011 will backup your clients just fine. If you have > 2TB in client backups then I don't see a way you can have these client backups being part of you Server Backup as well. I.e., if you lose a client, you can restore from server. If you lose the server, you still have the clients and a new backup will be made (once a new server is up and running). But, if you lose a client and the server at the same time (and you have server backup disks rotating offsite/safe), then you won't be able to resotre clients.

 

For any data that you do want to have backed-up in Server Backups, I would recommend 2TB HDDs (I think 2 partitions on a 4TB HDD would work as well but I can't be sure). For any other data, the bigger the better.

 

Last thing, and this is a personal thing, I would never partition a 3TB drive into 3x1TB without a very good reason (e.g. 2x2TB partitions so that Server Backup might be able to deal with this).

[Dude]

Thanks, I have a better handle on the backups now. I think I am going to seperate the data from the OS, and just backup up the OS and related items on the PC, so I should have small backups.

 

Most of the data I want to share among my family in the house.

 

Still I need to play with it more.

[dbailey75]

Thanks, I have a better handle on the backups now. I think I am going to seperate the data from the OS, and just backup up the OS and related items on the PC, so I should have small backups.

 

Most of the data I want to share among my family in the house.

 

Still I need to play with it more.

Dude in regards to backup, if your backing up at the drive level, your going to have the same folders scattered across each drive in the pool,  and you 'll also end up backing up the duplicated data as well as umfriend mentioned, not an efficient use of space, and it can add some head searching for a specific file in the backup especially if you have 3-4-5 plus drives in the pool.   Backing up at the share level is a simpler solution,  and you don't have to worry about backing up the duplicated data, but you'll need to find a 3rd party backup software.  there are tons of free and paid options.  I'm backup using Syncback Pro, but they have a free version as well.

[dbailey75]

I can't say I understand this all completely. I have 3 PC's and one HTPC to backup. 2 PCs have < 1TB each. 1 PC has 3TB and the HTPC has round 2.5 TB. The HTPC recorded TV is not critical to backup, but the 3TB pc stuff is (this disks on this PC are broken up into partitions with none > 1TB). What do you recommend I do? I have 2 4TB drives to start and plan on adding a pair more soon. I  havn't buit the WHS2011 server yet, waiting for hardware now.

 

also, if your using MCE for your recorded TV, the WHS 2011 Client connector has an auto archive feature, so that your TV shows are automatically archived to the sever, and any copy freely content is available to all PC's on the network, even Pc's that are not connected to a tuner can access the recorded media folder.  Copy once programing can only be viewed by the PC that did the recording, but the data can still be archived to the server for storage. 

 

I don't have a single drive over 300GB's in any of my PC's, everything is centrally stored on the server, after all that's the purpose of the server, centrally managed storage,  aside from the itunes library and .pst files,  there no other important data on the PC's, and as you can imagine, a clean install of the OS is breeze.  I'm looking really hard at Ihome server so I can have a single central installation of itune.