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Q: Thinking of migrating from Drive Bender


jmone

Question

Overall, I'm a happy Drive Bender user, have been for years, and no doubt would be fine for some time....  but given the recent changes at Division-M and Drive Bender going to Donation Ware, I figure now is the time to look proactivly at alternatives before some yet to be introduced change in the OS "breaks" my pools.

 

Pool 1: Main PC used for serving Media out to the house (on 24x7)  

    - Win10 64-Bit, 2x8TB, 7x4TB HDD all using ReFS, M1015 Controller (IT Flashed) + Mobo Ports.

 

Pool 2:  Backup Server I manually and periodically use FreeFileSync to review and then commit any any changes to from my Main Pool (as well as general PC Backups).  It is off most of the time.

    - Server 2012 R2 Esentials, 1x8TB, 3x6TB, 4x4TB HDD all using ReFS, Mobo Ports, cheap PCI SATA Cards (and a yet to be used Hotway 8 Bay HDD Drive Enclosure USB 3.0 e-SATA encosure)

 

I've read some of the threads and seem to have the answers that it will all be OK, but..... do you mind confirming the following specifics regarding a DrivePool implementation on both PCs for:

- Is ReFS supported on both Win10 and 2012R2

- Are the 8TB Seagate's OK to use

- Any issues with the mix of SATA/USB Controllers I've listed

- OK to continue to use Hard Disk Sentinel for SMART monitoring

- I don't use (or want duplication)

- I prefer Cascade over Balance for spreading the content across the drives (eg fill up one drive, move to the next)

- OK to use "Lights Out" on my 2012R2 to keep it asleep most of the time

- How fast is the Pool (eg I have teamed Dual Gigabit  - 2gbps)

- Any specific notes or issues serving media files (like with windows storage spaces and DVD stuctures)

- Any specific notes or issues with assigning permissions using Homegroup or UNC Shares

 

 

Thanks, and any other comments will be great!

Nathan

 

 

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Well that is "easy" so far, similar to the other thread on how to migrate all I did was:

- Install DrivePool and the Plugins

- Created a DrivePool using the Same Disks as DriveBender

- Added a drive Letter to each HDD

- Stopped the DriveBender and Stablebit DrivePool Services in services.msc

- On each HDD, moved the folders with content from the DriveBender to the DrivePool folders (eg not Recycle Bin, Vol Info etc), this only took a few minutes as it is a move not a copy process

- Rebooted

- Removed Drive Letters for the physical HDD

- Changed the Drive Letter and Name for the "Old / Now Empty" Drive Bender pool

- Changed the Drive Letter and Name for the "New / Full" Stablebit DrivePool to what I was using before

- Rebooted

 

...and not only is all my "stuff" where it should be, but the Windows Permissions, and UNC Shares were automatically re-established.

 

To test:

- Ran a FreeFileSync compare over this new Pool vs my Backup Pool (Drive Bender) and all looks good (I got one sub folder with a permission issue but it may have been as I was doing the compare while also changing other things.  2nd compare was fine).

- I use JRiver Media Center and did a missing File check (both on a Local and a Networked PC) = All good

 

So far Pretty Impressed.  Lets see how it goes over a week or so (I've Left DriveBender installed and working, just with no content in the folders). 

 

Thanks

Nathan

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Well, thank you for your interest!

 

And that's certainly a lot of questions. :)

 

- Is ReFS supported on both Win10 and 2012R2

ReFS is only supported on Server OS's officially (this is as per Microsoft, and requires a hack to support in client OS's, aka Windows 10). That said, we do have preliminary support for ReFS, and it appears to work fine. We need to do more testing to ensure complete compatibility with it. 

 

- Are the 8TB Seagate's OK to use

As for the 8TB Seagate Archive drives (I'm assuming that's what you're referring to... as there are absolutely no issue with the enterprise drives), see this thread:

http://community.covecube.com/index.php?/topic/1625-do-i-start-buying-8tb-archive-drives-or-not/

The TL;DR of it is, yes, they're fine to use (I have 5, with a 6th on the way), but write performance isn't great and you may want to use a dedicated "cache" drive and the SSD Optimizer (doesn't have to be a SSD)

 

 

- Any issues with the mix of SATA/USB Controllers I've listed

Absolutely none. The only issue is that USB isn't all that reliable, and I personally recommend against using it for long term storage. eSATA is better. 

That said, as for the cheap SATA cards... it depends on the chipset. SIL chipset based cards are horrible and shouldn't be used. 

 

 

- OK to continue to use Hard Disk Sentinel for SMART monitoring

Absolutely okay. However, we don't include integration with HDS, only for StableBit Scanner. But you can run both concurrently, without any issues.

 

- I prefer Cascade over Balance for spreading the content across the drives (eg fill up one drive, move to the next)
That's absolutely fine. You will need to download and install the "Ordered File Placement" balancer to do this though.
 
Once you've installed and enabled it, you should be fine.
 
- OK to use "Lights Out" on my 2012R2 to keep it asleep most of the time
Absolutely. And even better, we support the "running file" option for LightsOut, so that it creates a file when running tasks, so that LightsOut doesn't put the system to sleep. 
 
Scanner_RunningFile 
(this is done in the UI, so check the "Advanced Settings" section for details)
 
DrivePool_RunningFile 
 
If you have any issues with this, use a 3rd party text editor such as Notepad++, or let me know (the text config file for DrivePool can be finicky)
 
- How fast is the Pool (eg I have teamed Dual Gigabit  - 2gbps)
it's at least as fast as the underlying disks.  Since it's a file based solution, we can't do the same level of performance optimization that block based solutions (like RAID). 
That said, we do have a number of performance optimizations that may help.  Including "Read Striping" (complicated), and Network IO Boost (prioritizes network traffic over local disk access, at the expense of CPU). And here is a link talking about the features:
 
 
- Any specific notes or issues serving media files (like with windows storage spaces and DVD stuctures)
Don't store the Plex database on the pool (it uses hardlinks, which are not supported). Aside from that, none that I'm aware of. 
 
- Any specific notes or issues with assigning permissions using Homegroup or UNC Shares
Nope. In regards to permissions, it's just like a normal disk. No special considerations (aside form the Network IO Boost, for prioritization).
 
Though, I recommend using normal shares (using "fsmgmt.msc" to create and manage the shares) over homegroups. 
 
 
 
 
Additionally, you may want to check out this thread: 
 
It's a user created thread, but it outlines how to migrate from Drive Bender to StableBit DrivePool without having to spend hours and hours on moving files around
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Thanks Christopher for taking the time to go through these (and you were always great with the WHS Qs over at WeGotServed).  

 

I'll give it a go on my Main (not backup) pool and report back (I've read that migration thread a couple of times).  Followup Q on ReFS.  ReFS disks are a supported format type for reading in Win10 (and Win8) just fine without the "hack" (which you only need if you want to format drives on Desktop OS).  Have you heard of any Issues with ReFS and DrivePool?

 

Thanks

Nathan

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You are very welcome. :)

And yeah, I enjoy helping people and answering questions. :)

 

 

As for the ReFS, yup, I do know that. But formatting them is the problematic part. :)

As for issues, I've tested it bit personally, and didn't see any issues with it. But that was definitely not thorough testing. 

The other issue is that we only support the Windows 8.1 and Server 2012R2 version of ReFS. The Windows 8/Server 2012 version doesn't support alternate data streams, which is a problem. 

 

Aside from that, ideally, a pool should only be NTFS or ReFS, and not mixed, to ensure no weird compatibility issues crop up. And we should report the pool as ReFS instead of NTFS for ReFS based pools. 

 

That said, the beta builds do have preliminary support, and can be enabled using the Advanced config file. 

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So Far So Good.  Moved the folders from DB to DP and DP is now doing a "measuring".  Couple more Q as I'm new to the UI:

- Drive Mapping/Mgt: DB lets you assign drive letters etc to both the pool and drives from in their UI.  As I can see no equivalent in DP I take it I just use Windows Tools to do this?  EDIT: To Answer My Own Q = Yes

- In Balancing: Is it OK to have all the following checked (and is the order fine): 1. StableBit Scanner, 2. Vol Eq, 3. Drive Usage Limiter, 4. Prevent Drive Overfill, 5. Duplication Space Optimizer, 6. Ordered File Placement (I've only changed some settings in this one so far, eg 99% fill or 46GB ).  Started a new thread on this

 

Thanks

Nathan

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And we should report the pool as ReFS instead of NTFS for ReFS based pools. 

 

That said, the beta builds do have preliminary support, and can be enabled using the Advanced config file. 

 

FYI - It is reported as a NTFS pool (see pic) as it was with Drive Bender.  All seems to work so I don't really care.  Also - Is there something I need to enable in the Advanced Config File?

Thanks

Nathan

post-2289-0-04755600-1451802052_thumb.jpg

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Well, I'm glad to hear that everything seems to be going pretty much smoothly.

 

And as for the drive letters, that entirely handled by "you" and yes, by the Windows tools.

Also, if you want to mount the folders like how drive bender does, we have a guide on how to do that:

http://wiki.covecube.com/StableBit_DrivePool_Q4822624

(I do this personally, as I have 19 drives in my pool).

 

As for the ReFS support:

Well, this is probably an oversight, but looks like the beta build (2.2.0.651) and up allow for the adding of ReFS drives currently. 

 

Normally, this is an option in the advanced settings config file. But it's not, currently. And that may change until we are able to thoroughly test it out.

 

And to re-emphasize ReFS support is NOT tested, and could cause issues (up to and including corruption). We aren't sure as we haven't thoroughly tested it. 

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Well - I've got my main 40TB pool all on ReFS going strong so far! ... and I plan to swap a 4tb to 8tb drive when my other DB pool finishes adding some drive so I'll let you know if anything turns pear shaped.  I'd really encorage ReFS as I just don't get probs like I've had with NTFS and CHKDSK.

 

On the mounting - I normally just remove Drive Letters unless I need access to the disks for some reason, but happy with the mount to folder soln as well.

 

Thanks

Nathan

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Well, glad to hear it!

 

And yeah, we do want to add ReFS support. But there are only so many hours in the day. :)

I've done *some* testing, and it appears to work just fine.  But that's not the same as thorough testing. 

 

 

Though, heads up, some of the self healing of ReFS *only* works when using Storage Spaces and a parity (and maybe mirrored) array. 

 

And as for the mounting, either way. But a folder mount makes it easier to access, if you need to. :)

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True - I'm across the ReFS only limits but.... 

- no way I'm using Storage Spaces

- and it's way better than NTFS

 

Looking forward to where ReFS support is explicit as from my testing so far DP looks good as a replacement for DB.  I'll just keep my other backup pool on DB just incase something goes wrong for now.

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Aside from the GUID folder and the "FOLDER.DUPLICATE.$DRIVEBENDER" folders, I'm not sure what you mean.

 

The script should clear up the duplication folders, and you should have moved everything from the GUID folders to the PoolPart.GUID folders. 

 

So, there shouldn't be anything "left over" here. If there is, then yes, you'd want to clean that up (but be careful, just in case) 

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Sorry for the poor explanation.  I'm not using duplication at all.  What I mean is that of each physical disk, DB has an entire Folder structure even if that particular disk does not contain any content for that folder.  DP seems to not need this and only creates a folder structure where it holds content.  As I've just moved the DB folders into DP on each disk they now contain lots of empty folders that I don't think DP needs and I'm wondering if

- they should be removed manually

- if DP will auto do this at some point during scanning 

- it does not matter

 

Does that make sense?

 

Thanks

Nathan

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Actually, over time, StableBit DrivePool will do the same thing. It can/will leave empty folders on disks.  There is absolutely no problem with this, and should be fine.

 

However, if you really want to, you can delete the empty folders, if you wish.

 

But, no, it doesn't matter.

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Given the success after a couple of weeks of testing I've purchased a Lic for this PC and now moved on to testing DrivePool on my 2012R2 Essentials Box (also ReFS drives).  Used the same process to move the files from DriveBender to DrivePool.  All went fine (had to manually removed some long file paths).

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Given the success after a couple of weeks of testing I've purchased a Lic for this PC and now moved on to testing DrivePool on my 2012R2 Essentials Box (also ReFS drives).  Used the same process to move the files from DriveBender to DrivePool.  All went fine (had to manually removed some long file paths).

Glad to hear it! And that ReFS still seems to be working just fine!

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Testing on 2012R2 went fine so uninstalled DriveBender, purchased another DrivePool licence but I can't seem to activate it.  I punch in the Lic Code, hit enter, and it says "Licence Activated" but when I close this Window it stills says I'm in Trial mode.  Did this a few time (with a reboot in between) but same result.  Apart from that it is all looking good.

Thanks

Nathan

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Testing on 2012R2 went fine so uninstalled DriveBender, purchased another DrivePool licence but I can't seem to activate it.  I punch in the Lic Code, hit enter, and it says "Licence Activated" but when I close this Window it stills says I'm in Trial mode.  Did this a few time (with a reboot in between) but same result.  Apart from that it is all looking good.

Thanks

Nathan

That's ... odd.

 

This is for the 2.1.1.561 version (stable), right? 

 

If so, try the beta build (2.2.0.651) or try resetting the settings:

http://wiki.covecube.com/StableBit_DrivePool_Q2299585B

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File uploaded

Thanks

Nathan

Thanks. I've flagged the files for Alex, so we can look into the issue.

https://stablebit.com/Admin/IssueAnalysis/24906

 

 

We've had similar issues in the past, and the beta builds have fixes to address this sort of issue, so it *shouldn't* be occurring. The files may help point to why. 

 

Otherwise, if this happens again, run "chkdsk c: /scan /perf /r" and reboot the system afterwards. As that *may* fix the issue, if it's a disk access error. 

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